[Tom Houlihan]

Originally Posted by barrett.t

I also understand you wanting revenge especially when old ladies get hit over the head.

In truth, it's not revenge. However, they've committed a crime, and their incarceration should be unpleasant. It's like grounding your teenager and sending them to their room, but they have books, a TV, a computer, and a phone. Far too many of them live better in jail than they do at home. They get treated better because we're responsible for them. Far be it from them to show that much responsibility for themselves when they're out.

I think that non - violent prisoners should be trained in a skill to make goods. Or the less risky prisoners allowed out in the day to work or learn a skill and to go back to prison at night. The money paid from the profits of their goods and training then would have to compensate the victims and pay for thier upkeep.Also when they got out they might not return to crime if they had a skill.

In theory, I agree. However, just in our county jail, I've seen too many come back that have been through various training programs. Flat out, they just don't give a sh*t. They go through the motions while they're in here, to look good, then get out and do the same trash all over again. If it worked properly, I'd be all for these programs. Far too often, though, they're a waste of time.
Most jails, ours included, have a work-release program. Inmates are allowed out to go to their jobs. This is good, because it allows them to still earn money, keeping their houses, cars, jobs, etc. W-R inmates also pay rent to be in the program, which is based on their salary. We had one guy who worked in a hospital making beaucoup bucks that paid like $300/week. Most of them, though, pay the base rate of $80.
There is also a victim's compensation fund, but I don't know too much about it, or how effective it is.
Still, even with opportunities like this, we see the same faces coming back. If there were more of a deterrent, then maybe they'd stay out.

Tom I do repect what you do as a profession in england the third group for victims of violence are the police. you are literally on the front line taking abuse of all kinds. The penalties for attacking the police should be very severe indeed.

Thank you.

But I think if we allow these poeple to be brutalised in a prison system do we not become as bad as them?

I think this is where we really begin to differ. It depends on one's definition of "brutalisation." Is it brutal to restrict coffee, candy, and garbage like that? Is it necessary for life? Is it brutal to make the inmates wear colored clothing, so they stand out when they go out on work details? As far as I'm concerned, if your self-esteem is damaged because of the stigmatization of wearing jail garb in view of your friends and neighbors, that falls under the deterrent heading! If that embarrasses you, maybe you won't commit the crime again!!
On the flip side, I don't agree with visiting physical violence on anyone, unless it's required by a violent situation, such as a riot, or a physically aggressive inmate. In that case, then it's Katie-bar-the-door IMHO. Understand, while I will not go out of my way to be "nice" to the inmates in my charge, neither will I go out of my way to harass them. If they act like adults, I treat them as adults. If they act like juveniles, or just idiots in general, then I'll treat them as such. I will not pick on them just because I have a badge, and they don't.

Thankyou I have enjoyed the debate.

Although it's gotten my blood pressure up a few times, I have to. I must have, I came back even when I said I wouldn't! I'll admit, though, it hasn't actually degenerated to a pissing contest. You've been quite reasonable, even if I disagree with a lot of what you've written. But, I don't disagree with all of it.

Take care,
Tom