[barrett.t]

I admired some of them because of their bravery going to the gallows and their patriotism. Even so when I see pictures of the holocaust I then think they should hasve hanged them all. The allies were too kind letting some off with just prison sentences. Though the reports of the hangings are shocking and I don't believ in the death penalty really. It's just so sad that it ever comes to this. Kaltenbanner must of been in a delusion maybe he said this for his childrens sake if he had any.

[temujin77]

Maybe I misunderstood, but how can you admire war criminals? You're talking those who are responsible for death camps, for massacres, for the illegal execution of prisoners of war, and for waging unprovoked wars and wars of aggression. I have little pity of them.

Also, "brave" may not be the right word for it. If they've been sentenced to death, they really don't have much of a choice other than stepping up to the gallows. Well, I suppose the extremely cowardly could (and did) commit suicide before the execution, or in some cases even before the trial.

[Klaus]

I always had, and still have, a problem with "wars of aggression". Whoever came up with that phrase must have been a complete idiot. Which war isn't "aggressive"?

Cheers

Klaus

[temujin77]

Hehe Klaus, after thinking about what you said, I think I agree!

I suppose the victors came up with that term to justify their war, as in the US did not wage a war of aggression against the Axis powers.

[barrett.t]

Have you ever been prejudiced about anything? Apparently, I read somewhere 600.000 thousand Cambodians were killed as a result of the bombing of their country during the Vietnam war. To my knowledge no Cambodians fired a shot at the Americans. The British Empire was built upon wars of aggression. The Moaris were dehumainsed in New Zealand, the Aboriginis in Australia and the Irish were called stupid so they could not rule themselves to justify the British occupation of their countries. The British committed war crimes so did the Americans. I believe that we all are good and bad and sometimes the history of Nazi germany is so biased that we never see the good in them only the bad.

[temujin77]

To be perfectly fair, no, we don't see the "good" side in Nazi Germany easily because the victor writes the history. However, you'd have to say it's hard to find the "good" side for a government that systematically kills its own people.

Ok, so let's set aside the whole "war of aggression" argument.

I don't have the capacity to feel pity for war criminals responsible for the death of thousands upon thousands in death camps. Period.

[barrett.t]

But I do have pity for people who are suffering in any sense whoever or wherever. Period

[temujin77]

Hard to tolerate human suffer in any shape or form, of course. But don't you think most of these people deserved it for committing heinous war crimes? They have caused so much more suffering than what they were sentenced to receive, and not all of them acknowledge their wrong doing, either.

[barrett.t]

Yes they did desreve it but I do not agree with the death penalty intellectually although I sometimes do emotionally.

[temujin77]

So we established between us two that "bravery" and "patriotism" has little to do with their death sentences for war crimes, right?

Death penalty in itself is probably a whole other philosophical debate way bigger than this one

[barrett.t]

Yes you can still be a bastard and have good traits.

[barrett.t]

Yes you can still be a bastard and have good traits. Like you can be a nice guy and have bad ones.

[11th Panzer Division]

temujin77 said:

I don't have the capacity to feel pity for war criminals responsible for the death of thousands upon thousands in death camps. Period.

it depends-were they enjoying it or were they were doing it with a gun pointed to their head? einsatzgruppen members were put in mental hospitals and some even committed suicide because of all the killing.

[Baltasar]

There've been war crimes throughout history, although people didn't see it that way back then. How about the concentration camps for the Boers in South Africa, how about the USA wars of agression against the native population, how about the French prosecution of the Hungenots... there's no end to it and it will inevitably continue.

[Roddoss72]

Exactly, wasn't the US Government that ordered the wholesale wiping out of the North America Bison herds to starve the Indian population onto reservations.

And to lie to the United Nation to wage war against a sovereign nation.

This post has been edited by Roddoss72: August 22, 2010 - 03:56 AM

[daskooka]

Roddoss72, on August 22, 2010 - 03:55 AM, said:

Exactly, wasn't the US Government that ordered the wholesale wiping out of the North America Bison herds to starve the Indian population onto reservations.

And to lie to the United Nation to wage war against a sovereign nation.

I am assuming you are talking about Iraq.
1) Can you provide evidence?
2) Are you truly comparing the soldiers of Britain, Australia, USA, Italy and a dozen other nations in Iraq to SS camp guards?
3) Do the actions of the above nations since the wars in Iraq/Afghanistan to help those nations support your judgments?

Can you really talk about Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Pol pot, Mugabe, Karadžić, ect and add Bush, Blair, Howard and Mercle without a feeling it dosent quite fit?

[Jim O]

11th Panzer Division, on June 26, 2010 - 02:25 PM, said:

it depends-were they enjoying it or were they were doing it with a gun pointed to their head? einsatzgruppen members were put in mental hospitals and some even committed suicide because of all the killing.

I shouldn't be surprised that it was you who resurrected a three year old thread and implied a defense for war criminals. Who cares if they "enjoyed" it? That's almost the dumbest question I've ever heard.

Roddoss72, on August 22, 2010 - 03:55 AM, said:

Exactly, wasn't the US Government that ordered the wholesale wiping out of the North America Bison herds to starve the Indian population onto reservations.

And to lie to the United Nation to wage war against a sovereign nation.

There's an expression about people who live in glass houses.

Didn't your own country virtually wipe out its indigenous population and participate in that same war against that same sovereign nation? Not to say the US is blameless, but there's plenty of blame to go around.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised here too.