Article - Germans have right to honour war heroes

[Geek44]

After such a long time, I think it would be perfectly acceptable to have Germans and even Japanese marching during ANZAC day.
I agree with temujin77. I'd find it s stretch to believe that the rank and file of the German military were nazis. In my opinion, the German people were Hitler's victims as much as anybody else. They've also gone the furthest in aknowledging their past. I think that counts for a lot. But then who's past doesn't have the odd ghost in it?
Peace.

[McCoy]

Originally Posted by Geek44

But then who's past doesn't have the odd ghost in it?
Peace.

As they say to kids in Germany, "Be quiet now or the Swede will come and take you!"

[cyberia]

Originally Posted by Geek44

After such a long time, I think it would be perfectly acceptable to have Germans and even Japanese marching during ANZAC day.
I agree with temujin77. I'd find it s stretch to believe that the rank and file of the German military were nazis. In my opinion, the German people were Hitler's victims as much as anybody else. They've also gone the furthest in aknowledging their past. I think that counts for a lot. But then who's past doesn't have the odd ghost in it?
Peace.

Danke!

[cyberia]

Originally Posted by McCoy

As they say to kids in Germany, "Be quiet now or the Swede will come and take you!"

Its true. Scares the hell out of them!

[Geek44]

I don't know if you guys are aware of this, but lately we've had a change of government in this country. In my opinion, eleven years of shame is now over. Over the last 220 years, there's been a systematic and cultural destruction of indigenous culture...whether we like to admit it or not. I have a Dutch friend who regularly brings her young daughter over to play with my son and we drink tea. When she asked me 'Why aren't there any aborigines in the south?' I had to think about it. The truth is that in the south, the states are smaller and we've been very efficient at shooting, poisoning and massacring black Australians...and it goes on today. We have what is termed 'the stolen generation' whereby children of mixed race were taken from their families by the authorities of the day to be educated in white, often religious schools. Many never saw their black parent again, usually their mother...you do the math on that one. A large percentage of white Australia still can't see the problem in that.
Three weeks ago, the new Prime Minister made a formal apology to the stolen generation in the first sitting of parliament. What a day and what a feeling. I don't usually 'do' patriotic but I felt proud, empowered and strong. Like many, I sat in front of the TV while he spoke and cried my little eyes out. So did my partner and many of the good folks who went into the city to watch it on the big screen in Federation Square...thousands of people. So, aknowledging the ghosts in the past of one's nation is actually an empowering thing to do. I feel more optimistic now than I have for twenty years...that's half my life.
There's a lazy old idea that 'It can't happen here'...don't bet on it.
Peace

[cyberia]

Originally Posted by temujin77

Veterans of the Allied countries can at least celebrate the victory and celebrate their dead buddies as heroes. Veterans of the Axis cannot do the same.

Because our dead are not heroes? Who decided that?

I may be an American citizen now, but I will always be German born.

You may celebrate your victory, but we will decide how we honor our dead.

[cyberia]

Originally Posted by cyberia

Because our dead are not heroes? Who decided that?

I may be an American citizen now, but I will always be German born.

You may celebrate your victory, but we will decide how we honor our dead.

On second thought, sorry about the tone, temujin77. I'm sure you did not mean that comment in the context I took it.

Still a little thin skinned from "other" experiences "elsewhere".

My apologies, with the promise to do better.

cyberia

[Geek44]

It's my intellectual (as opposed to experienced) opinion that when the bullets start to fly, they're all just frightened little boys. Therein lies the tragedy of it all. In my opinion, honour is an odd concept. I pretty much don't buy it in the context of war myself very much. What I do feel is that the dead are all equal and the survivors all suffer...I've known vets...they're all in pain because of what they've done and seen. That needs to be aknowledged and the dead must be remembered...most of them are just ordinary people caught up in consequences not of their own making... May they all rest in peace wherever they came from. From what I've seen of governments, they all pay lip service to this stuff on a single day each year...and never hesitate to send them all off again when it suits them. I believe it's people such as we who do the actual honouring and remembering.

[cyberia]

Fantastic response, Nick. I could not agree more.:smile:

[Geek44]

What continues to baffle and disgust me is that despite the many lessons history has to offer, psychpaths like Hitler, Stalin, Milosevic, Pinochet, Ceaucescu, Amin, Pol Pot...these guys NEVER seem to have any trouble finding accomplices and people to 'do the dirty work' often by the thousands. This tells me a couple of things...they're charismatic and smart. It also tells me that this kind of madness must be just below the surface of more people than is usually apparent. It never ceases to amaze me how many people step forward whenever there's the slightest excuse for moral misbehaviour. My question is 'why is violence the default setting'?