Hitler had the Atom Bomb

[Kiwiguy]

Hi Roddoss72,

if you read my post above about Heisenberg at Farm Hall, he may have been hamming it up that the critical mass was half a tonne. Deibner, it is certain knew the real critical mass was nearer 20kg in 1945.

In practice, with all the safety cladding a workable Uranium A-bomb in 1945 would have weighed 4,500kg which was within the ability of a Ju-390 to deliver over New York from the Gardomen airbase near Oslo and return.

Had Germany used the A-bomb against new York I suspect the Allied A-bomb would have been used on Berlin, but that may have also delayed the use of an allied bomb against Japan and given the Japanese time to use their A-bomb too.

[oldbutshot57]

Hitler had determined to drop an Atomic bomb on New York. His engineers had design for a sub orbital plane to launch, basically go into a low orbit and drop back to be able to unload a nuclear bomb on New York. If he had any other plans for the bomb, I am sure it would have still included bombing America into surrendering to avoid all the cost and trouble of an invasion

[arkaneinc]

If Hitler had an A bomb his most likely target would have been Russia or the United States. Just from what I have read though I doubt it would have been on a specific target other than Moscow. Hitler would have most likely screwed it up though. Let's assume that he had another one to drop on American soil and assuming that he was able to do so I could see him dropping one on Washington.

The problem with assuming Hitler would even have an A bomb has already been discussed. His own people were trying to take him down. Hitler was a very misguided person and just seeing everything else that stemmed from his Leadership there is a higher probability that he would have put all the Jews on one side of Germany and used the A bomb on that side. I've studied a lot of what Hitler did in World war 2 and have come to the conclusion that besides having stage presence he was an egotistical mad man. Certainly unable to have patience long enough to develop an Atom Bomb.

Just remember this is the same man that blamed his own citizens for ruining the way of life for the rest of the German's. He blamed someone based off their religious beliefs. To sit here and ponder what would happen if Germany had an A Bomb is to ask would Napoleon have conquered more countries if he was taller?

[DocCasualty]

Salutations All

One question to Panzer228 how many atomics are you talking about.

Well if i were Hitler and had a supply of atomics on hand, they would be delivered as such.

Day one.

1st Atomic on Cambridge or Oxford (these are cultural and academic centres), the 2nd Atomic would be dropped on either Southampton (Idustrial and a major Royal Naval Port) or Birmingham (a key industrial centre).

Day two.

3rd and 4th Atomics would be dropped on Moscow (key military/political/economic/communications and Transportation centre) on the same day.

Day three.

5th, 6th and 7th Atomics would be dropped on Manhatten (Civilian/Ecconomical), Chicago (Industrial) and Washington DC (Political).

Regards

Roddoss72

Interesting "what if " thread. Sorry I came to the fray so late! I honestly think this one is just too fanciful and I guess Jim's "Mickey Mouse comes to Naziland" comment pretty much sums it up for me too.

Anyway, as a former Detroiter, I must take umbrage with Motown being left off the list of targets. From Detroit Michigan Hotels | Restaurants | Attractions | Real Estate

The "Arsenal of Democracy": Detroit and Wartime Manufacturing
In addition to churning out consumer goods effectively, the assembly line production scheme implemented by Ford served to meet the growing production demands of modern warfare.

Beginning during World War I and continuing through its more horrific sequel, Detroit served as one of the primary wartime manufacturing centers in the United States since automotive assembly lines proved useful in wartime production schemes. Detroit was such an important wartime manufacturing center during the Second World War, accounting for nearly 35% of the nation's total war production, that Franklin Roosevelt nicknamed it the "Arsenal of Democracy."

Hence, I think Detroit would have preceeded Chicago in strategic importance and would have been a little closer from the eastern approach as well. That being said, my present day living genes thank you for leaving the Motor City off the hit list, as my "what if" progenitors would have likely been wiped out.

p.s. - If you've been to Detroit lately, it looks as if it were the target of a nuclear attack. Sad.

[PanzerBob]

You know a man is serious about his city when he takes umbridge to being left off a atomic strike targeting list!!!

However, you are very correct, and I think you'd find that if the Nazi's had been developing an Atomics Strike Target List, Motown would have not eluded them.

Boy some days can be darker than others!

Bob out

[oldbutshot57]

due to the not so great number of nuclear weapons the in ability to procure and refine the radium needed to build bombs in mass scale, I think it would only anger those and later if not sooner the retaliation on Germany would be ten fold compared to what happened ...

[Roddoss72]

Salutations All

One question to Panzer228 how many atomics are you talking about.

Well if i were Hitler and had a supply of atomics on hand, they would be delivered as such.

Day one.

1st Atomic on Cambridge or Oxford (these are cultural and academic centres), the 2nd Atomic would be dropped on either Southampton (Idustrial and a major Royal Naval Port) or Birmingham (a key industrial centre).

Day two.

3rd and 4th Atomics would be dropped on Moscow (key military/political/economic/communications and Transportation centre) on the same day.

Day three.

5th, 6th and 7th Atomics would be dropped on Manhatten (Civilian/Ecconomical), Chicago (Industrial) and Washington DC (Political).

Regards

Roddoss72

Interesting "what if " thread. Sorry I came to the fray so late! I honestly think this one is just too fanciful and I guess Jim's "Mickey Mouse comes to Naziland" comment pretty much sums it up for me too.

Anyway, as a former Detroiter, I must take umbrage with Motown being left off the list of targets. From Detroit Michigan Hotels | Restaurants | Attractions | Real Estate

The "Arsenal of Democracy": Detroit and Wartime Manufacturing
In addition to churning out consumer goods effectively, the assembly line production scheme implemented by Ford served to meet the growing production demands of modern warfare.

Beginning during World War I and continuing through its more horrific sequel, Detroit served as one of the primary wartime manufacturing centers in the United States since automotive assembly lines proved useful in wartime production schemes. Detroit was such an important wartime manufacturing center during the Second World War, accounting for nearly 35% of the nation's total war production, that Franklin Roosevelt nicknamed it the "Arsenal of Democracy."

Hence, I think Detroit would have preceeded Chicago in strategic importance and would have been a little closer from the eastern approach as well. That being said, my present day living genes thank you for leaving the Motor City off the hit list, as my "what if" progenitors would have likely been wiped out.

p.s. - If you've been to Detroit lately, it looks as if it were the target of a nuclear attack. Sad.

Salutations

Well this whole idea is fanciful but if i were Hitler and i had a good supply of atomics late in the war and using them was the only option and i had the aircraft do carry out the mission these targets as i have indicated would be the way i would go, and to make you happy;

Day three.

8th Atomic (Detroit) (call it urban renewal) hahahahahahahahahah.

Regards

Roddoss72

[NagaSadow]

From Geheime Kommandosache Nr. 4268/LXXX V, Expose Um 3538 from August 1944 by Prof.-Dr. Eugen Sänger and Dr.-Ing. Irene Brendt

According to Dipl.-Ing. Bernd Schulze it shows most likely the expected effect of a 7kT plutonium bomb on New York. According to Werner Grothmann, Himmler's adjutant, a similar plan existed for London.

Source:
Für und Wider "Hitlers Bombe" (Pro and Contra Hitler's bomb)
by Rainer Karlsch and Heiko Petermann

[DocCasualty]

Day three.

8th Atomic (Detroit) (call it urban renewal) hahahahahahahahahah.

Regards

Roddoss72

Best plan I've seen proposed in over 40 years! Maybe you should forward it to the former mayor, Kwame Kilpatrick, while he's still serving his prison sentence. Bet he'd like to nuke Motown!

According to Dipl.-Ing. Bernd Schulze it shows most likely the expected effect of a 7kT plutonium bomb on New York. According to Werner Grothmann, Himmler's adjutant, a similar plan existed for London.

Source:
Für und Wider "Hitlers Bombe" (Pro and Contra Hitler's bomb)
by Rainer Karlsch and Heiko Petermann

That's fascinating! Do you know what they were basing this proposed blast effect on? Surely this must have been on the basis of theory alone, as the Los Alamos detonation had yet to occur. Does the book mention how accurate this estimate would have been, had they had the technology to implement a 7 kT plutonium bomb? I don't know what kind of estimates the Manhattan Project crew were coming up with prior to their initial detonation and how accurate they ultimately were in those estimates.

[Roddoss72]

From Geheime Kommandosache Nr. 4268/LXXX V, Expose Um 3538 from August 1944 by Prof.-Dr. Eugen Sänger and Dr.-Ing. Irene Brendt

According to Dipl.-Ing. Bernd Schulze it shows most likely the expected effect of a 7kT plutonium bomb on New York. According to Werner Grothmann, Himmler's adjutant, a similar plan existed for London.

Source:
Für und Wider "Hitlers Bombe" (Pro and Contra Hitler's bomb)
by Rainer Karlsch and Heiko Petermann

Salutations NagaShadow

Also to think about is the Nuclear Fallout, depending which wind direction this could ramp up radiation casualties, then there are the effects of secondary deaths due to cancers and the like, pretty nasty stuff all 'n that.

Regards

Roddoss72