Did Roosevelt push Japan into attacking Pearl Harbor?

[50th]

I have a friend that believes that the high command either knew about the impending invasion and were ordered to do nothing, or that Roosevelt pushed the Japanese into attacking Pearl Harbor in order to get us into world war two. What are your thoughts? I think someone knew about the impending invasion, but how much they knew is uncertain. Still others believe that the whole thing was orchestrated by Roosevelt to get us into the war. I don't believe that.

Don't worry, the poll will not display your username, so you can be completely honest.

[Freightshaker]

I think he used his knowledge of Japanese culture to 'steer' them into war with the US. When he put the trade embargo on Japan to force them to withdraw from China he knew they wouldn't comply since that would result in a huge loss of face.

[Jim O]

Originally Posted by 50th

I have a friend that believes that the high command either knew about the impending invasion and were ordered to do nothing, or that Roosevelt pushed the Japanese into attacking Pearl Harbor in order to get us into world war two. What are your thoughts? I think someone knew about the impending invasion, but how much they knew is uncertain. Still others believe that the whole thing was orchestrated by Roosevelt to get us into the war. I don't believe that.

Don't worry, the poll will not display your username, so you can be completely honest.

There's no question but that Roosevelt provoked Japan with the oil embargo, but what he really wanted was war with Germany There is also a difference between provoking another nation and actually wanting war. Roosevelt knew that public opinion at home would not allow any war without a direct attack or a declaration of war.

I don't believe that intelligence was intentionally withheld from field commanders. I think Churchill was a happy man when he found out the news about Pearl Harbor, and Hitler played right into both their hands four days later with his declaration of war against the US.

Honestly I think Roosevelt would have been happier to fight Germany first and then deal with Japan if necessary. Losing all of those warships at Pearl Harbor was a huge blow to war efforts in both oceans, and would have been prevented if possible.

As for the "invasion", which invasion do you mean? The invasion of the Philippines? Or are you still referring to the aerial assault on Pearl Harbor? If the former, any military strategist would know that the Philippines were a likely next target given their location. What Japan needed was oil from Indonesia and control of Malaysian rubber (both also likely targets). In order to safely ship it back home she needed to control the sea lanes, and for that she needed the Philippines as well.

[Wustenfuchs]

This may be off topic, but nevertheless. I think Hitler declaring war on the United States was perhaps the best thing he ever did. Imagine the Soviet Union occupying a defeated Germany, all on their own. I think the German people suffered terribly even during our occupation, the suffering would have been far worse under total Soviet occupation. Hope this makes sense, I can see where it may lead people to misunderstand what I'm saying.

[salinator]

The oil embargo was just the breaking point as it was primarily the Japanese military that depended on oil while much of the Japanese economy still relied on coal.

It was the embargo of steel, tin, copper, aluminum, and rubber that threatened to stop the Japanese industy in it's tracks. Japan had almost no natural resources of it's own, and it's occupation of China was mostly for agricultural land.

The embargoes were not just to stem Japanese military growth, but to choke the Japanese industry and to wreck it's economy.

[Miss Saigon]

I just read about this in a book on MacArthur. The book said that Roosevelt imposed the embargo after Japan occupied IndoChino. It said his intention was to use it as a political tool. The idea was that the embargo could be loosened or tightened to express varying degrees of approval or disapproval about Japanese actions and policies. Much the way LBJ thought he could send messages to the North Vietnamese with his bombing campaign. Both men miscalculated badly.

The Author of the book I am reading suggests that Roosevelt was thinking Politically with the embargo, not militarily.

I have to agree with those who said that Roosevelt wanted into WWII. He wanted to fight Germany. Provoking war with Japan would not necessarily have forced that had Hitler not declared war. It could very easily have gone the other way, where Americans wanted to now focus all their efforts on their own war, not Europe's.

[McCoy]

The embargos surely could only lead to war. I think Japan would have been content for a few more years with China before lookin' south if it wasn't for their total isolation due to the US embargos on such things that an militaristic n' expansionistic were in dire need of. So yes, The US did more than just nudge Japan into a full scale war.

Then there's the little thing bout MAGIC to be considered. High placed officers did in fact knew what was comin' due to MAGIC.

[Pylon1357]

Originally Posted by salinator

The oil embargo was just the breaking point as it was primarily the Japanese military that depended on oil while much of the Japanese economy still relied on coal.

It was the embargo of steel, tin, copper, aluminum, and rubber that threatened to stop the Japanese industy in it's tracks. Japan had almost no natural resources of it's own, and it's occupation of China was mostly for agricultural land.

The embargoes were not just to stem Japanese military growth, but to choke the Japanese industry and to wreck it's economy.

Glad that I read this post before I replied, Saved me from having to make sence out of my thoughts.

IMO yes the Japanese were pressed into the attack on the US. They had little choice as I see it, however I think they also knew they didn't have a chance.

Something that always gets lost here when discussing Pearl Harbour is the fact that on the same day as this attack, the Japanese attcked the British and Commonwealth Forces in Hong Kong.

[salinator]

Originally Posted by Pylon1357

IMO yes the Japanese were pressed into the attack on the US. They had little choice as I see it,

At the very least, the Japanese saw no face-saving way out.

however I think they also knew they didn't have a chance.

"I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant, and filled him with a terrible resolve......" Isoroku Yamamoto

Something that always gets lost here when discussing Pearl Harbour is the fact that on the same day as this attack, the Japanese attcked the British and Commonwealth Forces in Hong Kong.

Also attacked on that day were The Philipines, Guam, Wake Island, Midway, Malaya, Thailand, and Singapore. But according to international dateline, all those attacks took place on 8 December 1941, although Malaya was attacked 3 hours before Pearl Harbor while Nagumo was still steaming toward the Hawaiian Islands.

[Horch]

The South Pacific had to wait in line. The war in Europe was deemed more important. And yes. I am one of those who believes FDR knew of the impending attack and goaded Japan into war. Although I don't no if he thought the attack would be as devastating as it was. He did know it would push the US into war. And I also believe Churchill knew of the coming attack as well.